Tank Comparisons

Here is a comparison chart of Modern Main Battles Tanks that I've been working on. You're free to use, modify and share it according to the license listed in the document.

The license is as below:

As the creator of this work, I own the copyright to this document. I allow redistribution, copy and use this work with or without modifications is allowed under the following conditions:

1. Redistributions must retain the above copyright notice, with my name (Sniperz11), and this list of conditions;

2. Redistributions in modified form must explicitly state the fact that the document has been modified.

Any other rights are released by the author.

Some points to note:

1. I have tried to make it as comprehensive as possible, but not being a subject expert, the parameters for comparison elude me.

2. I have also strictly adhered to taking data only from authentic sources, preferably only the user or manufacturer websites. The source of this data has been indicated in the comments on each cell, and in the sources worklist. If you are also modifying this, I request you to do the same.

3. The information for some parameters, for eg, Armor ratings are highly classified; while there is no information for other tanks, like the Chinese Type-99.

4. Please ensure that you give data relating to the most common version of the latest variant of the tank. For eg, for Merkava, provide data for the Merkava Mk.4, or M1A2 SEP for the Abrams, and Leopard 2A6 variant.

5. As you will see, there are huge blanks in the document. I look forward to your assistance in this regards. If you are creating a new version, or modifying any information, please ensure that this is mentioned in a disclaimer/license text at the back of the excel sheet.

6. I request you to also create a seperate worksheet in the file, and list the alterations to the original file. This will make it easier to create a common version from many.

You can upload your version (please make sure that the filename contains the date updated and your name) on any site in the net (box.net is a good one; rapidshare is the among the most popular), and give a link to the URL on a comment to this post.

Thanks

Download links:

Please let me know if there are any problems with the download or viewing. Thanks.

1. Box.net - Tank Comparisons_July 24 2008_Sniperz11.xls

2. Rapidshare - rapidshare.com/files/132615218/Tank_Comparisons_July_24_2008_Sniperz11.xls.html

Sick and Tired

Aah, the Arjun fiasco continues. One lacks the patience or endurance to care any more about what happens next. Even if the Army does accept the tank, it will do so grudgingly, defeating the whole purpose of inducting a cutting edge tank. The Arjun has given the Army a perfect opportunity to usher in a Revolutionary in Military Affairs (RMA) , and create a new operational doctrine for their armored Corps who have till now been working with old, Soviet Era tactics.

But it appears that with the T-Series, the Army is following the "Familiarity breeds contentment" logic. Look at the most vehement and mindless opposition to any opinions or directives to conduct an impartial evaluation of the Arjun.

Things will not change till new minds inhabit Sena Bhavan. Till that day comes, I can only wait and watch and gnash my teeth at the destruction of our indigenous technology and a potent weapon. We can only hope that DRDO doesn't feel the same and comes back with a vengeance with a far better Mk.2 tank that the Army cannot ignore.

Arjun Video from DD

Found this video on google. Its a 13 minute Doordarshan piece about the Arjun tank, and has some truly delectable footage for people with an Arjun fetish.

Now, neither DD nor any of the other news channels really know what they're talking about when covering Defence technology. Even if they do, the coverage must cater to the layman, most of whom care about the Arjun as much as they do about little green men on Mars.

Still, these stories do provide a wealth of information, not so much in what they say, but what they show... and this 13 minute exclusive piece is full of never-before-seen footage and details of the Arjun tank, stuff that only the National Carrier will be allowed to show. Enjoy the show.

Link: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3997119991218613108



Some highlights (at least for me):

1. Footage from Ashwamedh/Rajasthan Trials.
2. Coordinated fire from 5 tanks. Also see the firing from 5 tanks.
3. Arjun navigating sand dunes at speed, neutral turn and turret traverse at speed.
4. Gunner: "Arjun is able to hit targets even at 25 kph in day or night".
5. Old footage of the scientists at work - all of them look so young and enthusiastic at the time (M. Natrajan, H.M. Singh, Kalam, etc).
6. Extensive shots of the manufacturing area.. especially loved the boulevard-like shot through the barrels - 50 pretty Arjuns all in a row.
7. Video of night firing
8. Inside shots of Crew area.
9. picture of the planetary gearbox

Arjun Mk.2 Approved

Finally, there was official army confirmation of the news that most well-informed insiders knew -
the Arjun Mk.2 will be developed. This was confirmed by the Army Chief during the 3-day AFV meet that is being organized by the Army in New Delhi. The short report from Zee News is scant on details, but I'll try and fill you in.

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NEWS/newsrf.php?newsid=9608

Army okays development of Arjun Mark II tanks

New Delhi, Nov 13: The army on Tuesday gave the go-ahead for developing next generation indigenous battle tanks after a successful run of the original model Arjun.

Based on its experience in designing the Arjun MBTs, the DRDO was coming up with a lighter and more versatile version called Arjun MK-II which is expected to meet future needs, Army chief General Deepak Kapoor told an international seminar on Armoured Fighting Vehicles here.

Defence scientists are also working on the Tank X project comprising features of Arjun and Russian-supplied T-72 tanks.

The function organised by the CII was presided over by Minister of State for Defence Rao Inderjit Singh, who asked Indian companies to invest and participate more in production of weapons systems.

Bureau Report

Some more details from IDRW.org report:

http://www.idrw.org/2007/11/13/indian_army_seeks_next_generation_battle_tank.html

Indian Army seeks next generation battle tank

The Indian Army has sought a new generation main battle tank (MBT) even as it reluctantly prepares to receive the homegrown Arjun tank that has been over three decades in the making.

'What we have today is mid-level technology. What we need is a tank of international quality,' Indian Army chief Gen. Deepak Kapoor said Tuesday.

'I have no doubt that the DRDO (Defence Research and Development Organisation) will be able to develop indigenous capabilities for coming up with a better answer and more versatile armoured fighting vehicle (than Arjun) in the future,' he added while speaking at the inaugural session of an international seminar on Armoured Fighting Vehicles, the first to be held here.

Kapoor also called for synergy between scientists, users and producers to ensure the delivery of a cutting-edge-technology tank.

'The scientists cannot work in isolation. The users (the army) should be with them. So also should the producers, be they the public sector undertakings or private players. Only then will we see an indigenous armoured fighting vehicle of international quality,' the army chief maintained.

Now, the Arjun Mk.1 never really found many supporters in the Army, many of whom were angry at the long gestation period and the constant problems. While the Arjun was, in theory, an excellent tank, it used a mish-mash of indigenous and foreign components, many tailor-developed for the Arjun. Obviously, with such high technology and the inexperience of scientists in the field use of these systems (not helped by the Army, which kept pushing Trial dates), the systems performed exceptionally well in the labs, but tanked in the Field.

But in the past two years, especially after the 2005 trials where the Army gave a clear to-do list to DRDO, these problems were systematically solved, and DRDO commenced a war-footing overhaul and repair work on the systems. Most of the problems were ironed out, and a grueling internal testing of the Arjun, which performed well. These efforts finally turned a corner a few months before exercise Ashwamedh, which was held in April this year.

Truly confident of their product, the DRDO was ready for user trials, but the Army wasn't. In a coup of sorts, the DRDO bulldozed the MoD and Army into including fifteen Arjuns in the large scale war games. The games, held in the hot Thar summer, also gave the Arjun an opportunity to show its new self, and its performance in heat, something that had caused it problems aplenty in previous trials. Less than pleased, there was nothing else for the Army to do but obey the Raksha Mantri's diktat. The results were clear. Arjun outgunned the Ajeyas and T-90s. The T-90s were beset with problems, many of them the same problems that had afflicted the Arjuns not so long ago- Suspension issues, Fire Control System Failures, and frequent stoppages.

In light of this new look Arjun, both DRDO and MoD were agitating for comparative trials, something that even the Army had, till a few months before, had been insisting upon. Suddenly, as the T-90s looked shaky, the Army got cold feet- after many postponements and delays, the Army finally cancelled the trails altogether, instead replacing them with an AUCRT, which should theoretically bring the Arjun into full scale service. But considering the Army's reactions, that seems doubtful.

But the message that the Army was getting was clear- the Arjun is world-class material, and with a little tweaking, could do a world of good. Plus, it would be foolish to rely on the T-90, a series whose development is reaching a plateau. After all, a small, light tank can only do so much. Plus, the T-90 is far worse protected than the Arjun, something that gives it a weight advantage, but at the cost of certain death to the crew in any conflict involving even moderately successful ATGMs. The T-90 would be hard-pressed against the newer tanks that will enter service around the world in a few years- the M1A2, Korean XK-2 and Al-Khalid upgrades, which will outgun the T-90. This, along with a need to expand the Armored Corps, led the Army to the revelation that it will need a modern tank in the future. There is a requirement for almost 3000 tanks to replace the old T-72s and Vijayanta tanks.

The Army has formulated a requirement, GSQR 2020, which will spell out the needs for a modern tank to be in service by 2020. This will be released to DRDO soon, and its clear that the Modernized Arjun, a Mk.2 variant will be able to fit the requirement. This will give the Army a fleet of Arjun Mk.2s and T-90s, a stable that echoes the WW2 style of different tank classes- Infantry and Cruiser Tanks.

The only question is, what name will the new tank be given? I have a suggestion- Abhimanyu.

Shiv Aroor's Arjun Ride

Here is the half hour Headlines Today special about the Arjun MBT, filed by Shiv Aroor (Blog) from the Heavy Vehicles Factory and CVRDE testing range in Avadi, Chennai. The lucky fellow got to spend two full days with the Tank, and was even given a chance to take it for a spin and get a few bumps and scratches on the paint.

There isn't much new information about the Tank thats said in the report, which is understandable given that the focus is on the layman who doesn't know a T-72 from a Mig. The camera-work is patchy, and wastes a lot of time showing repeats of the road-rage antics of Shiv the Driver. Still, considering that its a 20 minute long report, there are still some great bits of info, most notably a look into the impressive state-of-the-art manufacturing facility for the Arjuns. In addition, there are lots of small bits of info that can be gleaned by careful observers and enthusiastic analysts.

Shiv has a post on his impressions at his blog:
http://livefist.blogspot.com/2007/10/what-now-arjun.html

Take a look:

Part 1:


Part 2:



This latest piece echos Ajai Shukla's report about the Arjun in May, where he too did not have any criticisms of the Tank.

At that time, there was a palpable sense of both hope and anxiety. Hope because the DRDO was confident that it had a world-class product that would come out on top in the comparative trials; anxiety because the Army is notoriously obstinate about having exactly what it wants (even with best-of-Brochuritis). In addition, Arjun's long development and a strong Russian Arms Lobby make it all the more disliked by the Brass.

With the cancellation of the Comparative Trials, a travesty of monumental proportions, the DRDO's fears came true, but they quickly salvaged it by planning the Accelerated User Trials. Lets hope this isn't another hogwash. One thing is clear though- the Arjun has arrived.

Its a great achievement on part of the DRDO PR apparatus that they have converted two people, who till recently were hacking at the Arjun and DRDO. Lets hope they can convince the Generals as well.

Interview with Dr. Atre

Frontier India has an extremely informative interview with Former Scientific Advisor Dr. V.K. Atre, who is uncharacteristically blunt and direct about the level of commitment the Services have shown in DRDO projects, preferring to go in for foreign solutions. Considering that Dr. Atre has rarely given interviews & has never criticized the Armed Forces or media before, this is really a revelation, and a wake-up call.

The former DRDO Chief is clear that DRDO has got a lot of flak that it scarcely deserves- the Sources, Armed Forces, An Ignorant Media, Foreign Vendors and the Import Lobby, all with an axe to grind, an interest to serve, or simply trying to cover their own mistakes.

DRDO-bashing is the easiest thing to do, since it is the focal point of all indigenous weapon systems development. Production & Quality problems are blamed on DRDO, even though it doesn't produce equipment, only develop it. Delays are caused by the services, which delay or mess up Staff Quality requirements (the Redesign of LCA wings, or the Arjun Project), or MoD bureaucrats who sit on files, or push pennies to try and save money, at the expense of destroying national security. All these are conveniently forgotten when journalists blame DRDO for any problem that ails the defence projects. And with an active defence contractor Lobby that will do anything for billion-dollar cheques and an easily-influenced media, its no wonder that the spate of recent anti-DRDO rants have been published.

We must be clear that DRDO is at fault in many cases, and is not perfect. But the fact remains that it has been expected to develop world-class systems for costs that Foreign companies throw monthly parties for. Look at the Trishul- how can anyone expect results for a measly $70 mn. Or the LCA, which has reached the stage its at for just $500 mn. The F-22 Raptor has already spent over $60 Billion, and the JSF another 15 billion. The much maligned Arjun has spent only 315 crores to reach the state its in now. And it is a world-class system comparable with the Abrams (which was a $6 bn project) and the latest Leopard 2s.

Dr. Atre comes out strongly against these criticisms and has presented a strong defence of the DRDO, which has had to navigate through a lot of dirt hurled at it to get crucial projects ready. Frontier India also has a lot of other related articles that together, tell the same sad story of conspiracy and slander against the DRDO, which has had to keep quiet and rely on retired officials to defend it. Please read this extremely well written piece (link: http://frontierindia.net/indigenous-defence-research-looking-through-drdo-prism/).

P.S.: Keep looking out for good news on the Defence projects front. A little birdie (Mr. Chacko Joseph from Frontier actually) tells me that a lot of great news is coming up... will update as it comes out.


Indigenous defence research - looking through DRDO prism

Indian Armed Forces are used to import Defence systems from abroad and use them mostly for training and during operations whenever necessity rises. Most of these systems are in free flow production in their respective countries and sometimes inducted by their Services. These systems, therefore, have got the maturity in terms of engineering, production and maintenance. This provides the comfort zone for the three Services to induct, operationalise and maintain these weapons.

The most important aspect is that these weapons, are not designed keeping Indian environment, tactics, operational doctrines or user’ preferences in mind. They are not customized for the convenience of the Indian Armed Forces. Even then, they are accepted by the Services based on their maturity level. Even in those cases where partial quantities are produced in the country, mostly in Indian Ordnance factories (OFB) and Defence Public Sector Units (DPSUs), there is hardly any technology transfer taking place. These items would already have been produced in large quantities in their respective countries and would have reached end of production life for their own use. Many times, the tooling will be transferred to Indian production line accordingly. Though the products are subsequently made in India, most of the raw materials and components still have to come from the parent country and the value addition by Indian Industry is very small, varying from 10% to 30%. Even then, this is a preferred route for the OFB’s and DPSUs as there is no risk for them. They have assured product line and order quantities from the Armed Forces. Most of time, the critical high end system’s technology is not passed to India. It is a form of “Technology Apartheid.” India ends up paying exorbitant prices and foreign exchange.

The international arms market runs with political and monetary diplomacy. The arms majors adopt all tricks of trade to push their wares. India is one of the largest importers of arms in the world, hence these issues imply to India too.

With this background, it is natural that the Indian Armed forces hesitate to accept Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) developed items as they know that even after DRDO successfully develops, there would be a reasonable time gap before a smooth free flow production gets established by the Indian Industry. There is also pressure from import lobbies and vested interest which cultivate the sensation seeking mass media for defaming Indian indigenous research.

It is to be noted that all countries which develops a complex defence system has gone through the same pains and problems as DRDO before serial production gets established.

Frontier India Defence and Strategic News Service interacted with Dr. VK Atre who has held the position of Scientific Advisor to Minister of Defence. I covered in depth on the DRDO point of view on the state of indigenous Defence Research.

There are 4 state actors when it comes to indigenization of weapons.

1) The Ministry of Defence (MoD)
2) The Armed Forces
3) The Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO)
4) The Public sector defence production units (DPSU)

There are 3 non state actors which influence the outcomes
1) Foreign Vendors
2) The Mass Media.
3) The Import Lobby

The Ministry of Defence

Ideally the MoD should act as the bridge between the scientific & technical community and the armed forces.

On the role of MoD in indigenization Dr. Atre say’s “Variable. There are occasions when MoD has supported DRDO strongly and there are occasions when they have not. It depends.... (read more)

Arjun MBT Video from NDTV

Ajai Shukla of NDTV recently did a story about the Arjun MBT from Avadi, Chennai (at the Heavy Vehicles Factory of the OFB) about the planned comparative trials between the Arjun and the T-90S of the Indian Army. Being a former Armored Corps Officer of the Indian Army, I can think of few better qualified persons to report about the tank.

However, past reports and opinion pieces from Shuklaji have not been as generous to the Arjun or DRDO. These views, backed by his qualifications should be taken seriously. Stronger views have been expressed on his blog ([1], [2]). Obviously, supporters of the Arjun and defence enthusiasts were quick to contradict his views, with strong and passionate responses, not all necessarily based on fact and scientific analysis.

There has, of course been a general suspicion towards Defence reporters, considering the large number of highly inaccurate (and often downright scurrilous) reports that have emanated from various quarters, aided by 'anonymous sources', 'army officials' and 'retired officers'. It doesn't help when we have a mushrooming of anti-DRDO reports that emerge just before significant milestones are being reached in the programs- Trishul, Akash, Agni-III, Tejas, and now, the Arjun. Many times, these are ladled with gratuitous amounts of sensationalism & hyperbole. Worse, the information is often quite old, and downright false. Thus, it was quite a shock to see Shuklaji's piece.

When I first saw the report, my first impression was that it was Vishnu Som (an excellent and objective Defence Correspondent) reporting it. Imagine mine (and quite a few other's) surprise when we saw that it was from Ajai Shukla himself, and, even more surprisingly, it was actually complimentary to the Arjun. Shuklaji did this exclusive piece with obvious glee, and certainly seemed to treat the Arjun like his own pet dog.

One wonders what has changed in the Arjun that made him change his opinion about it. After all, he has been a vocal opponent of the Arjun project, and has often called for its closure, or a thorough revamp. Perhaps his seniors at NDTV had clear instructions on what to report, but given his expertise in the field, this seems unlikely. Probably DRDO allowed access to the Arjun on the condition that he did not denigrate it, a slightly more likely prospect. Still, AS is too shrewd to not allow his opinions to slip into the report.

The most likely reason, and indeed, the one I hope is true, is that the Arjun has come full circle, and has shed all its previous problems, and has now truly become a world-class tank worthy of joining the Abrams, Leclerc, Merkava and others, and standing tall among them. Lets hope that next month's trials prove it right. A report by AS about his personal feelings about the Tank would be eagerly awaited.

The tank itself is quick and nimble far beyond its weight and size. The stabilized gun looks impressive, as does its state-of-the-art Hydropneumatic suspension. It sure looks to kill, and in a month, we'll know whether it is as good as it looks.

Return of the Exiled Warrior part 2

Here is the report about the Arjun MBT from India-defence.com, regarding the facts from the 15th Standing committee on defence.

The complete report may be found from the Official Lok Sabha site at http://164.100.24.208/ls/committeeR/PAC/5th.htm.

The excerpts of the report from
http://www.india-defence.com/reports-3199:

The following are excerpts of the response of DRDO and the Ministry of Defence to the 14th and 15th Standing Committee on Defence regarding the development, progress and present status of the Arjun Main Battle Tank (Arjun MBT):

-- Technical issues in the Gunner’s Main Sight and Gun Control System have been resolved. Suitable modifications have been carried out in these sub-systems on the initial five tanks of MBT Arjun by DRDO, the agency involved for conception and development of the project;

-- DRDO has conducted successful evaluation and handed over five tanks to the Army on 20th Jun 2006;

-- Between February and March 2007, DRDO and the Indian Army conducted Joint Receipt Inspections (JRI) of up to 29-40 Arjun MBT's;

-- Price comparison between 60 ton Arjun MBT and 50 ton T-90S not viable due to inherent difference;

-- Firing accuracy of Arjun MBT far superior to T-90s or T-72s, can engage targets at 2500 meters;

-- Production model of Arjun MBT costs Rs 16.80 to 17.20 crore per system;

-- Power pack, Gunner’s Main Sight and Track are imported components, which work out to 58% of the cost per tank; I

-- Import content can be progressively reduced with increased production orders;

-- Indigenous Gunner’s Main Sight (IGMS) enables the crew of the tank to engage targets under static and dynamic conditions by day and night with enhanced hit probability;

-- Indigenous production of power pack through license production is feasible with enhanced production order for Arjun MBT considering the economy of scale;

-- Arjun MBTs been driven for over 60,000 kms and fired more than 8,000 rounds, no defects detected;

-- DRDO's involvement to cease after OFB produces 30 Tanks, DGQA to take over;

-- Heavy Vehicle Factory (HVF) to produce 50 tanks a year from 2009 onwards;

Return of the Exiled Warrior

The DRDO has chosen its names well. They are always beautiful and evocative, deep in mythological significance (of which, we have no dearth) and give a good indication of the thing in question. There are the missiles, Agni, Prithvi, Akash, Trishul and Nag. Then, there is the Tejas, Marut, the Simhika Sonar system (Simhika was a demon who lived in the sea between Lanka and India, and swallowed Hanuman, an apt name) & co.

Into this group now comes the Arjun, with his bow (tank gun), Gandiva, and backed by Bhishma (T-90). Ironically, the Arjun has, like its mythical counterpart, had to battle not just Bhishma for recognition, but a whole armyfull (pun intended) of doubters and enemies. It has had to go into exile for a long time (almost as long as the Pandavas). But now, its time to return from the wilderness. and the Arjun surely has got people talking. And scared.

After ironing out the problems in the Arjun, the DRDO has confidently put it through its paces... made it fire over 8000 rounds, and travel over 60,000 km, without incident. It was confident enough to give 5 Arjuns for testing to the Army, and another dozen for the recently concluded Ashwamedh Exercises in Rajasthan, where it faced off against over a hundred T-90s and T-72s. And reports seem to indicate that it performed well.

Now, latest reports indicate that the Arjun will make a splash later this year at Army testing, and will be inducted in numbers by 2009. This was revealed to the 15th Standing Committee on Defence by MoD and DRDO officials. A full excerpt of the conversation will be put up late. The good news about the Arjun has been coming in the past few months with increasing frequency and intensity. There were the reports of a revolutionary new Armor that had been developed by DRDO scientists, which even US is interested in. Then, there were the reports of the effectiveness of the Arjun Armor, the cleaning up of all the problems that the Arjun had before, and the Ashwamedh reports.

It is disappointing, though not unexpected that the Media has not taken this up with its usual gusto. But of course, for a media that has made money by bashing the DRDO, why should this good news be reported. Of course, there haven't been many official statements and reports about this. And since when has the media needed official statements to tear the DRDO to pieces? How many reports have we seen that have quoted 'unnamed officials' or 'retired officers'. The same media that reported the IJT crash at Aero India with such 'Schadenfreude' was unnaturally quiet when the first production LCA made its maiden flight. We can expect the same for the Arjun. The DRDO, on its part, is ignoring these reports and continuing its work with a vengeance, letting its actions speak for itself.

The good news hasn't gone unnoticed. The defence enthusiasts on the myriad fora that pay attention to the DRDO's good work are ecstatic about the spate of successes- the PAD, Brahmos, Agni-III, LCA, and now, the Arjun. Some newspapers and web journals too are reporting the good news. As reports are pouring in about problems in the T-90 (most of them, the same problems that the Arjun faced), its becoming clear that the Arjun is not the fiasco that it was called for the past 15 years, but is shaping up to be a tank that will match the best in the business, and go further.

It was said that when Arjuna and Krishna blew their conches, Devadatta & Panchajanya, all who heard it trembled and enemies feared for their lives, while their allies found courage and hope. As the Arjun is thundering towards induction, the conch roars are growing louder, and those who thought less of it are thinking again, and those who will face it are scurrying for answers.